Putting Weight on an Underweight Horse - April 2000 discussion Disclaimer: Please note that none of the information contained in these files is meant to be professional information. Consult your vet, attorney or other professional for their advice. From: Bovver Subject: EQ-ResQ: feeding suggestions?? Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 12:02:00 -0400 Hello everyone.. My name is Shawn Landry, and I've just kinda been lurking for a bit.. I'm coming to you now seeking some suggestions on feeding a 15 year old TB gelding. "Streak" is in very thin condition.. He is a cribber, although he has been wearing a cribbing collar for sometime now, and has not even tried to crib since he started wearing it. His front teeth are in unbelievably good shape, considering.. however he doesn't have any back teeth at all.. He has just been out to pasture, as of late, with nothing but grass to eat, and has been progressively been getting thinner. When the daily hay was given, he would attempt to eat it, but could not chew it. The owner has just given me the okay to start him on a daily feeding program to help him out, as long as she doesn't have to do the work herself. The goal for her is to have him sold to whoever will take him, even as is, if necessary.. she just doesn't want the responsibility... my goal is to get him up to weight, riding again, and feeling better, and then either buy him myself, or sell him to someone who is willing to give him the special diet and care he will require. My questions to this list are this... I'm looking for any and all ideas and info on bringing a horse with no back teeth up to a good weight. I will be feeding him four times a day a soaked pellet and beet pulp mix. I was wondering about anything that someone could suggest to add to this.. supplements, or other weight building/maintaining substances.. Being a TB, and one that can be a little hot to begin with, any ideas on adding weight without making him super hot, would also be appreciated. With all the horses I've worked with, I've never had to bring one up to weight from such a poor condition...as I said... he has just been on pasture, so I'm also looking for recommendations on the right amount and lengths of time to start him gradually.. to build up to the standard full rations... I don't want to overwhelm his system, going from straight grass to a full blown grain diet. Anyone with info, links, personal recommendations, or pointers in the right places to look for info.. may email me at: bovver@intelos.net Thank you sincerely for all your help, and again.. I'm glad to be a part of this list... Shawn Landry bovver@intelos.net ============================================================ From: DOGCRAZY Subject: Re: EQ-ResQ: feeding suggestions?? Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 17:32:20 -0400 Corn oil is a good, safe weight builder. Also, since he can't eat hay very well try feedingt him Purina Horse Chow it has roughage in it, not just grain. What happen to him that he doesn't have back teeth? He seems young for that problem. have you actually looked at them, maybe he needs a dentist specialist? I know from some other lists I am on that some places you need to worm panacur at double dose for 5 days to rid the horse of some worms that aren't gotten any other way. He may be due for something like that, too. ========== DOGCRAZY ====== ============================================================ From: "slyshot" Subject: Re: EQ-ResQ: feeding suggestions?? Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 21:05:14 -0400 >I will be feeding him four times a day a soaked pellet and beet pulp mix. > I was wondering about anything that someone could suggest to add to > this.. supplements, or other weight building/maintaining substances.. This is an excellent starting point, make sure its a 10% complete pelleted feed, maybe a cup at each feeding and gradually increase. The soaking will help him to consume and digest it better. There is a divergence of opinion on whether beet pulp really helps put the weight on. We rarely use it as we have good success with the complete pellets. Corn oil can also be gradually added. With his chewing problems Denji hay, which is pre-chopped, would give him something to 'graze' on. I wouldn't worry about adding any supplements until you wait and see how he does on the feed and hay. If he is going to be on paddock turnout while you are getting him back up to weight, you might put some regular hay out for him to munch on, even if he just quids it up. From what you have said this horse clearly needs to see a vet or equine dentist ASAP. This could make a major difference in his ability to regain the weight. Has he been on any sort of deworming program? If not, follow the vet's advice on how much and when. Klondike (Cris May) Days End Farm Horse Rescue (MD) http://www.defhr.org ========== "slyshot" ====== ============================================================ From: Knockingwood@aol.com Subject: Re: EQ-ResQ: feeding suggestions?? Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 23:08:07 EDT I acquired a six year old Thoroughbred (also a cribber) who was in poor condition. She was very thin at 16.2 hands, <900lb, and had little appetite. I began adding corn oil to her ration, and saw improvements almost immediately. Corn oil (being a fat) is extremely energy dense (4:1 compared to carbohydrates) , is easily digestible, and requires no chewing. However, it is important to introduce it gradually into the diet, in 1/8 cup increments, mixed with morning and evening rations, over the course of two or three weeks, until a maximum of (2) eight ounce cups per day is reached. Research has shown that 2 cups per day is the most a horse's digestive system is capable of processing. Hope this helps you out! ========== Knockingwood@aol.com ====== ============================================================ To: equinerescue@imagicomm.com From: Bovver Subject: EQ-ResQ: feeding suggestions Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 00:22:04 -0400 Sender: owner-equinerescue@imagicomm.com Reply-To: equinerescue@imagicomm.com, Bovver Cheers, Everyone... WOW! I didn't expect such a quick response from so many people..!!! Thank you! I'll do my best to reply to everyone within this one post... Several people suggested corn oil.. upto 2 cups a day, gradually building up.. is there such a thing as "too" much? I'm only asking out of curiosity.. was just wondering what too much, or not building up to it, would do... the three main suggestions from several people were.. Equine Senior, Purina Horse Chow, and a 10% complete pelleted feed... I'm considering the pellets.. (we currently use Trotter) and beet pulp, both soaked... I've used Equine senior before for older horses (a 26 year old upto a 33 year old) but they were only used lightly or not at all... so my question on that would be... would it be worth feeding a senior feed to this horse considering that he will be ridden again (once back up to par) for smaller shows, lessons, fox hunting... and such.. ? Other than the loss of weight due to not getting enough of what he needs, he is still quite healthy, sound, and very ridable.. (I won't let anyone get a saddle near him until that weight is back up though!) He'll still be on pasture along with about a dozen other roly poly guys we have, along with the four feedings a day he'll be given.. I am still interested in finding out more about some of these supplements I've seen.. such as NU Weight, and WeightBuilder... I'm not sure whether I would need them or not, but just want to get some back ground info on them.. if anyone knows of a link to info on the "Rations Plus" supplement that was suggested, or an idea who makes it, please let me know.. I have used Source in the past with great results for coat, hooves, and general appearance.. but hadn't heard much about for help gaining weight... but would love more info on that as well... As for why he has lost these back teeth, I do not know.. I personally, have just come into this situation.. he has been there for about a year now... He is wormed regularly, update on all shots, shoes like clockwork.. it was when he first arrived there and the vet came to do teeth, that it was found that he didn't have the back ones.. and nobody is sure why, that i know of... although I am looking into this... I've just contacted an old vet friend, and hopeful we will come up with a nice feeding program for him.. I just wanted to get as much info as I could.. I'm big on trying to really do all my "homework" ~smile I'm located in Virginia.. and as I had said, I'm considering buying him myself, if not I only want to see him sold to someone who thoroughly understands the undertaking it would be... He would make a really nice junior jumper, or adult/amatuer jumper for someone, once up to par.. He can clear 5'6" like it was nothing.. his original purchase price was 2500, it would of course be less then this now... but I'd rather not sell him until I've had some time to work with him, myself.. and at that point I may just want to keep him for me! ~grin I had a little bit of money I've been saving to get a mare I can show and breed at some point in the future... but that may just have to wait.. I'm a single mom, and my financial resources are a bit limited.. I put in a LOT of hours at the barn, for not so great money, but I love every minute of it.. And my 19 month old son is absolutely addicted to riding! this horse is pretty special to me, even if I haven't known him very long.... I guess I kinda already think of him as my other kid..~smile of course, the final decision will be up to the owner at that point... Again, I wanted to thank everyone on the list for all the great and quick responses... and the wonderful stories of your similar situations, and experiences... please feel free to continue to email me any other info you may come across.. and if I can ever be of help to anyone, all you need to do is ask... Thank you, all... Shawn ========== Bovver ====== ============================================================ From: DOGCRAZY Subject: Re: EQ-ResQ: feeding suggestions Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 08:42:17 -0400 I agree with the 2 cups corn oil, only because that is what my vet recommened for my old burro. I thought I'd let you know Horse Chow is also a pelleted feed. It contains some grain as well as roughage(hay). It comes in 3 different protien percentages to fit your needs, usually horse chow 100 is adequate for most horses. >Several people suggested corn oil.. upto 2 cups a day, gradually >building up.. is there such a thing as "too" much? I'm only asking out >of curiosity.. was just wondering what too much, or not building up to >it, would do... > >the three main suggestions from several people were.. Equine Senior, >Purina Horse Chow, and a 10% complete pelleted feed... I'm >considering the pellets.. (we currently use Trotter) and beet pulp, both >soaked... I' Diane W NC USA...the Lord Blesses all http://www.equinenet.org/dogcrazy/index.html Check out my site ========== DOGCRAZY ====== ============================================================ From: "theresa meadows" Subject: EQ-ResQ: feeding suggestions?? Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 11:27:41 -0400 >the three main suggestions from several people were.. Equine Senior, >Purina Horse Chow, and a 10% complete pelleted feed... I think it would probably be good for him...it's easier to chew. My older Appaloosa mare is on Equine Senior, and does very well on it. I still ride her too...dressage lessons, trail rides, maybe some shows are in our future...and you certainly don't have to worry about them lacking energy to do what you want them to do. >let me know.. I have used Source in the past with great results for >coat, hooves, and general appearance.. but hadn't heard much about for >help gaining weight... but would love more info on that as well... I beleive there is a supplement called FocusWT which is made by the Source company, it says it's Source plus special stuff to help with weight. ========== "theresa meadows" ====== ============================================================ From: "slyshot" Subject: Re: EQ-ResQ: feeding suggestions Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 20:24:29 -0400 > if anyone knows of a link to info on the "Rations > Plus" supplement that was suggested, or an idea who makes it, please > let me know.. I can't recall who makes Ration Plus but I've seen it in a number of equine catalogs. See if Valley Vet has a website, I'm reasonably sure they carry it, or State Line Tack. Klondike (Cris May) Days End Farm Horse Rescue (MD) http://www.defhr.org ========== "slyshot" ====== ============================================================ From: "BigPaw Enterprises, Inc." Subject: EQ-ResQ: feeding suggestions?? Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 21:49:55 -0400 I have a TB who is always a struggle to keep weight on. We use a cycle of supplements added to his 12% grain: A: Corn oil (1/2 - 1 cup) B: Rice Bran (3 cups) C: Weight Builder (2 "doses", 2 of the cups that comes with it) After using Rice Bran all winter, we now use Weight Builder [WB] or WB and oil with good results. Our next step would be to include a "lunch" meal in addition to his AM & PM meals. Has anyone used Ration Plus or the new NU-Weight product? We are always looking for new products to try, & would like to hear about others experience. Take Care, Donna O'Leary donna@bigpaw.com HiHopes Horse Haven Caring environment for neglected horses http://www.hihopes.com ========== "BigPaw Enterprises, Inc." ====== ============================================================ From: Jim Willis & Nicole Valentin-Willis/Tiergarten Sanctuary Trust Subject: EQ-ResQ: Feeding suggestions Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 09:42:21 -0400 "I agree with the 2 cups corn oil, only because that is what my vet recommened for my old burro." I think I remember reading (possibly in "Equus"), that the most corn oil an adult horse can metabolize per day is 1 cup. Those kinds of recommendations are usually based on a 1000 lb. horse. I give my Arab mare half a cup per day in the winter only. Jim ========== Jim Willis & Nicole Valentin-Willis/Tiergarten Sanctuary Trust ====== ============================================================ From: "Windfield Farm" Subject: Re: EQ-ResQ: feeding suggestions Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 10:08:31 -0400 >I can't recall who makes Ration Plus but I've seen it in a number of equine >catalogs. See if Valley Vet has a website, I'm reasonably sure they carry >it, or State Line Tack. *** Actually I think they have their own website and you can order it directly from the company. I believe the URL is www.rationplus.com. It is a fabulous product - I have had a lot of success with it with debilitated horses. Nanci ========== "Windfield Farm" ====== ============================================================ Disclaimer: Please note that none of the information contained in these files is meant to be professional information. Consult your vet, attorney or other professional for their advice.